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« Bad night, little difference | Main | The thinker vs. the viper »

October 04, 2012

Comments

japa21

Definitely the pundits. It is only a disgrace for Romney if he actually gets called on it in a way that the public sees it.

Regarding Obama's performance. I believe it was the debate with Clinton prior to the PA primary. It looked like Obama was ill, maybe bad cold, or something, but he didn't come across well at all. Plus, that was the debate with George Stephenapolous and another person moderating and it seemed attack Obama all night long. I well remember the despair after that debate, that it may well have been Obama's doom.

History shows otherwise.

Robert Lipscomb

One would think that campaigning is now limited to debates only.

Obama has an exceptinally good campaign staff and has now enlisted a group of highly competent speakers to represent them in public. They will now move out and follow up on the lies and secrets of the Romney campaign. And the campaign ads.

To repeat myself and the president, "What's he hiding?"

Answer: Secrets and lies - and Reaganomics.

Robinswing

Funny I had a sinking feeling leading up to the debates. This morning I feel great! Probably because watching Obama I have seen time after time that things seem to bend in his direction. He loves 'coming back; and He actually did allow Mitt the Twit to paint himself into a corner. I knew going in that no matter what happened he would not 'win' the debate last night. Newt has said one true thing about Mitt. ""You cannot debate a liar". Romney lied. If he thought his ideas were good he wouldn't lie about them. In this time of instant communications he will get caught in his mendacity. You can lie but you can't hide. He will be on the trail today lying again. This time it won't take fact-checkers to call him out. He will do that himself. The real winners will be the American public when Mr. Obama is re-elected. Last night cemented his victory. IMHO

Kath

I operate on the assumption that 85% of the time pundits have no earthly idea what they're talking about. That way when they say something stupid I don't feel so bad. Look, I don't buy the media spin that Romney "won" last night. I saw sleezy performance delivered by an insuffrable arrogant prick. While he may have managed to domitate the forum by sheer aggression, I'd be willing to bet he did himself no favors among undecideds. Moreover, his lies have only provided OFA with more fodder. I imagine once the dust settles and the poll numbers don't move the media gods will have to conjure up some other narrative.

You Don't Say

Obama should have been the first to call him out on his lies. Romney is a lying SoS and Obama was too timid. Both observations can be true.

Robert Lipscomb

@Robinswing: You (and Newt) make a great observation, one which one of last night's commentators made. You can't debate a liar. Well, actually, you can.

I suspect that neither Obama nor his camp could comprehend Romney's capacity and willingness to lie in front of millions of people.

I assume that there are effective strategies for debating a liar. I also assume that Obama and his staff will develop and deploy that strategy.

Maybe, the real takeaway from last night is that Romney finally revealed his true self - the man willing to tell any lie, to do anything to get what he wants. He is not an immoral man. In most things he is a very moral man. In the realm of his career, he worse than immoral, he is amoral. I have met many people like that in business.

This probably explains the continuim of reports that everyone (Dem or GOP) who runs against Romney ends up despising him.

Romney, like Neo-Reaganism, is not open to honest compromise. This is why both must either be vanquished, or must be submitted to. That is what Obama must do to win. If he does, he will become the transformational president he wants to be.

Marc McKenzie

@Robert: Well said. Especially this:

"Maybe, the real takeaway from last night is that Romney finally revealed his true self - the man willing to tell any lie, to do anything to get what he wants."

Robert Lipscomb

@Robinswing: I just cruised some mainstream sites. The Big Lie story is already emerging.

As I recall, Ryan tried this during the convention and was outed almost before the teleprompter was turned off. His reputation immediately crashed and burned.

If Romney can be shown to be a liar - not "spinner" - there will be huge negative consequences for him.

Kath

As I type, President Obama is on stage busily mocking Romney for blatantly disavowing so many of his own positions. I too have noticed that real reporters have begun to write about the sheer number of whoppers Romney told last night. This is why I refuse to allow the events of last night to get me down. While I agree the circumstances were not ideal. What seperates the great leaders from the good is their ability adapt to even the the most adverse conditions. I suspect, the President decided at some point to simply let the weasel hang himself. Whether he knows it or not, Romney is tied to the claims he made last night and PBO and the Democrats will pummel him with them for the nest 30 odd days.

japa21

Just as an aside. There have been a lot of people disappointed in Obama's performance last night, saying he looked subdued, not really into it, etc. It should be noted that prior to the debate he had a conference call with NATO leaders about the situation between Turkey and Syria, which has a real potential to flare up into a hot war.

A challenger only has to be concerned with the actual debate. The incumbent has a lot of other things fighting for his attention.

Joy

I wish the President had looked a little more energized, but I think after a few news cycles and debunking of Romney's blatant lies the dust will settle and we will see a strategy behind this. I don't think he expected to be in a debate that was basically unmoderated and with an agressive and unrepentant liar. Obama is awake now and I don't expect there to be a repeat. I remember the debate japa referred to with Clinton so I am not too concerned about his performance last night. The cable news coverage of the post-debate was outrageous (MSNBC)however. I don't say this very often, but thank you Rev. Al.

Robert Lipscomb

I consider all this a gift from God. Romney has shown his true nature and that of the GOP by going well beyond spin and flip-flopping and on into outright lies and deception.

This opens the door for Obama to call out Romney for his spin and flip-flops while his operatives can call out Romney, Ryan and the GOP for lies and deception. This opens the door for a full-throated eviceration of the lies and decptions of neo-Reaganism.

Ansel M.

P.M.'s post, plus the above comments, provide an excellent analysis of what happened before, during, and after the debate last night. MSNBC is one of my main sources for political news and analysis, but I have to say that the post-debate meltdowns by Chris Matthews and Ed Schultz, in particular, were disgusting! They apparently bought into their own hype and inflated expectations. As others have reminded us, this is "long-game" Obama, and Mitt WILL be the the loser as a result of this debate!

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